Sonar shoot through transduser placement

[KevinR]

has anyone out there installed a shoot through sonar transduser in a checkmate. i have 1997 21 Br Pulsare and was wondering if anyone had installed one and where they found to be the best location. any ideas or info would be appreciated.

 

[eboch]

Hi Kevin;

I am plannig on the same install ... a Uniden Sonar....shoot-thru-hull.

The instructions say that a balsa core (amongst other non-solid-fiberglass hull constructions) is not good.

Did you ever install yours? how did it work? where did you put the sonar transducer?

eboch

 

[Boston Predictor]

Ive installed a few transducers. If your boat is balsa cored you can carefully cut out the core in that area. Youll want to mount it aft obviously, in a spot that will always be below the water line. Avoid mounting it where there is potential for air bubbles (chines, strakes stc,) also avoid mounting it in the center of the hull (above the keel) other than that, just mount it where you feel is the best location. Probably the bildge of a pulsare

 

[JW]

I haven't got the guts to put a large hole in the balsa core of a high-speed boat. Strength? Water intrusion from inside? I imagine you have to epoxy the transducer into the hole you've cut, so how do you get it back out for replacement if the transducer fails? The entire hull of your Checkmate is balsa cored, from the pad all the way up to the rub-rail. For that matter, all above the rub rail too

Both the Pulsare I bought used and this Pulse I bought used had depth sounders, and both had the transducer mounted to the outside of the transom. Three small screw holes. No fiberglass or core to shoot thru, just three holes to make sure are sealed properly so the transom stays dry. Properly adjusted, the transom mounted transducer will not affect high speed operation.

If anyone does install a thru-hull transducer in a Checkmate, take many detailed pix of the installation so we can see what it looks like! I've never found a Checkmate with a thru-hull, and I'd like to see how the install looks compared to the transom mount style. Would make a great thread!

 

[Boston Predictor]

Double post...

 

[Boston Predictor]

JW, you are right about the depth sounders, That's the way I would go on a small boat like this, unless he was installing a GPS system.
The through hull transducers can work through a balsa core, I know that much for a fact but it is not recomended. The hole by no means is large though. Probabbly less than 3'' (in my case) What I did on our last build was trace out the area where the transducer was going to be mounted and with a die grinder, just grind down the balsa cored area until it was flat even and clean. I did'nt have to go throught to the fiberglass. Then I epoxied the hole with a layer of resin to seal the core from water. Then I installed the mounting bracket that the transducer sits in with Silicone. No screws, or epoxy. Then filled the bracket with 2.0 oz mineral oil and installed the transducer. It snaps right in for easy access. Ill get some pics of it all installed tomorrow.

 

[TR450]

A friend of mine who has been into boats for years mounts his in silicone also.This way if it does'nt work it is easy to take out .You can make a well or mold out of cardboard so the silicone holds it's shape.I am going to do mine this way in the Spring(which I hope is soon.)He has also done the mineral oil thing. Agreed this would be a good "How To" post with pictures.

 

[Boston Predictor]

Ill be installing 3 more of these in the next month. (not in a checkmate though)hehe
But I will take some pics of the entire process and write up a how to

 

[eboch]

Hi All;

I am really trying to avoid the external sonar head (I has one of these on my MX) and I also dont want to core or cut the the hull in any way. I was hoping someone had experience just siliconing the depth sounder transducer head to the inside of the hull (... yes the sounders instructions say to

I was thinking of the bildge bay or the storage locker as mounting locations that are easy to get at.

The unit I have is only a depth sounder, it is not a bottom mapper or fish finder. My thinking is that the primary distortion cause by the hull is straight attenuaion of the signal which translates into reduced operating depth range. This is OK for me... all I want is a shallow water alarm function.

Anyone have any comments or experiences with this?

Thanks
eboch

 

[Enticer1]

Locker

Hi All;

I am really trying to avoid the external sonar head (I has one of these on my MX) and I also dont want to core or cut the the hull in any way. I was hoping someone had experience just siliconing the depth sounder transducer head to the inside of the hull (... yes the sounders instructions say to

I was thinking of the bildge bay or the storage locker as mounting locations that are easy to get at.

The unit I have is only a depth sounder, it is not a bottom mapper or fish finder. My thinking is that the primary distortion cause by the hull is straight attenuaion of the signal which translates into reduced operating depth range. This is OK for me... all I want is a shallow water alarm function.

Anyone have any comments or experiences with this?

Thanks
eboch

Eboch, I tried the silicone method in the locker of my Sportfire with poor results. I talked to another member with a Starflite and he told me to mount the transducer in the bilge area for better results.

 

[eboch]

Enticer1 ... When you say "poor" performance" ... what were you seeing?

The unit I have has adjustments that can be made for double bounce as well as high thru-hull loss. But what I am worried about is that the air-trapped in the balsa essentially renders the thing useless as a depth sounder .... in a similar way to when a sonar sees air under the hull at the location where the transducer is located (which happens often, for example, when running a transom mounted version and moving at speed).

Eboch

 

[eboch]

I got out on the water last week .... played around with the shoot-thru sonar. I gooped up the transducer face with aloe gell (its mostly water .. and it cleans up easily).... tried to make it work thru the locker floor... wouldn't work .. not at all ... even when the boat was stationary. I then tried the bildge hole ... worked fine ....both while moving and stationary. The only thing I noticed was that it did not work to 150' as spec'd ... topped out at ~ 135'. In shallow water (10') I checked its reading while in the bildge and with the transducer over the side of the boat in the water ... same readings. I'm now putting the base in permanently (manufacturer says to silicone in the base, then fill with mineral oil...then lock in the sonar transducer.

eboch

 

[powerstroker]

my buddy put one on his pulse a few years back and it worked pretty good for a while, but then it just stopped picking up things like um the bottom of the lake and fish so it pretty much was crap, So he switched to the transom mount and it has worked great, unless you get going over 60mph, just a food for thought.

 

[zstevens]

i did mine , but no hole in the core , i just sanded the mat of the fiberglass then cleaned up mess inbeded the transducer . it worked great till i realized my mix of epoxy was crap , so i tore it back apart redid it w 4200

 

[Seamate]

Depth Sounder w Smartcraft

Has anyone used the shoot thru hull transducer for Smartcraft gauges?

I was going to try this setup in a Pulsare 2100.

Any info would be appreciated. Thanks

Joe

 

[eboch]

...an update...

For the permanent installation, the sonar head I have requires that a mount be siliconed in and then filled with mineral oil (the sonar head then clips into this mount). I installed this in the location in the bildge where the sonar head had tested OK. When all assembled, I tested it again and it didn't work at all. I then took the head out of the mount and tried the head directly on the hull. I tried the head coated with sythethic grease, with uncured fiber-glass-strand mixture and with nothing ... they all worked. So I modified the mount to hold the head against the hull with a thin layer of synthetic grease on its radiating face. Worked fine.

The unit I have is a Uniden QT-206.

Two things about this guage I do not like ... 1) the depth alarm has a minimum setting of three feet; and 2) you can't simply (i.e. one button) silence the alarm once its activated.

eboch

 

[Vandalizer]

Good info here- I'm planning on doing the same thing with my Enticer. The only thing I haven't checked yet is how big the sensor is, and whether it'll fit in the bilge without needing to rip the tank out.
I've looked at the Hawkeye depth sounders as well- anyone know much about the performance and ease of use of the Hawkeye vs the Uniden?

 

[Double J]

I have a 24OO pulsare which I installed a 5" color sonar/chartplotter(Garmin). It had instructions to mount in balsa by cutting it out. Well I just sanded the area I planned on mounting the inhull transducer,silicone it down, filled the cup with mineral oil and monted it. Works great and haven't had a problem with it. So yes it will read thru balsa. Now you will want to mount it as far rear of the boat as possible and as centered as possible. Hope this helps.

 

[wca_tim]

I have an inexpensive uniden through hull with the transducer mounted off center about 6 inches forward of the stern under the oil pan in my diplomat. I didn't cut the hull at all, only roughed it up a bit so it would stick. It's shooting through both the balsa core and the pad. I bedded it in epoxy after running it to be sure it was going to work. It works fine as long as the hull is in even contact with the water, but loses the bottom when we get over 55 or 60 even on calm days.

 

[Vandalizer]

The Norcross Hawkeye Depth Sounder (which is essentially the same thing as the Uniden's that are described here) has a pretty good installation document here:
http://www.norcrossmarine.com/products/DF1000D/support.htm#

It also states that anything other than solid fiberglass isn't a good idea, but I plan to give it a shot... I'll just TEST before affixing! They're also pretty clear that anything other than epoxy is a BAD idea.