2100 BR Prop Question, Again

[jhw304]

Thought I would ask again since there seems to be quite a few more choices in props available than a couple years ago. I am currently playing around trying to find the best prop for my 2100 BR with an 2015 ETEC 250HO on it. I prefer the 4 blade Trophy plus (26p) at the moment but it is a couple mph slower than my 27p Raker II (3 blade). The Raker likes to chine walk more than the Trophy. 68 mph with the Trophy Plus, 70 mph with the Raker II. I have the factory 6 inch setback. Engine mounted up as high as she will go. The etecs are torquey and like to blow out so it has been a challenging, but fun quest for the perfect prop. (please dont tell me to hang a merc on the back of it) lol...

I am thinking of trying a 27p Trophy Plus since I am running close to 6000 rpm and can probably turn a higher pitch still. I dont know of any other 4 blades that the pulsare hull really likes. I am thinking I can get it to 75 with the right prop...and still be able to pull tubes and kids around if needed..

Thoughts? Your favorite prop??
Jeff

 

[karzrus]

I think you may want another 8 -10" of set back, (if speed is what you want)
And if those E-tec's can get water to cool the motor (low water pick up) you may want to raise the motor so the prop centreline is level with the pad. I don't know if you have a similar gear ratio in that motor as my merc 250xs, but 6000 rpm and a 26 trophy plus should be faster than 68 mph. 250+HP on a 2100 = 80+ mph.

Set back also helps reduce chine walk on these hulls.

 

[Sam I am]

I would STRONGLY recommend trying a Bravo 1 FS or XS...my G2/Starliner loves them.

 

[ForbesZ]

I would STRONGLY recommend trying a Bravo 1 FS or XS...my G2/Starliner loves them.

That's what I wanna try as well - Bravo 1 XS. Just not sure what pitch to get.
Would you happen to know how their pitch relates to that of a Trophy Plus? With a 25p Trophy Plus I'm getting ~73 MPH @ 6000 rpm and with a Trophy Plus 28p around 75 MPH @ 5400 rpm. This is with 14.5" setback, 1.75 gears and an inch below pad. If I were getting another Trophy Plus I'd try a 27p, but I'd like to try the Bravo 1 instead.

 

[Sam I am]

There's a lot of info on the Bravo I's on the thread linked below. If you hit the Mercury page for each prop it will tell you where to go pitchwise from different props. But if memory serves me correctly, I think you're going to pitch up about 1.5 from your Tempest Plus.

http://www.bbcboards.net/showthread.php?t=744981&highlight=

 

[ForbesZ]

There's a lot of info on the Bravo I's on the thread linked below. If you hit the Mercury page for each prop it will tell you where to go pitchwise from different props. But if memory serves me correctly, I think you're going to pitch up about 1.5 from your Tempest Plus.

http://www.bbcboards.net/showthread.php?t=744981&highlight=

Thanks! The Mercury pages didn't have any comparison to the Trophy Plus props ... they only compared them to the Tempest, Fury and Revolution 4 (none of which I have tried on my boat). But for the Bravo I FS it says to pitch up 1" from Tempest and 2" from Revolution 4 so maybe I'll stick with 28" pitch for the Bravo I since it seems to pitch lower and the 28" Trophy Plus was a little too much pitch for my setup.

 

[Mark]

I would STRONGLY recommend trying a Bravo 1 FS or XS...my G2/Starliner loves them.

2x The Etec is a torque monster and needs a big diameter 4 blade. You are probably good with 6" setback as there is natural setback built into the motor. I had a 250 G1 and the best prop was a Rev 4 but it will not be enough pitch for your rig as they only go to 25p

 

[blacktruck]

Thought I would ask again since there seems to be quite a few more choices in props available than a couple years ago. I am currently playing around trying to find the best prop for my 2100 BR with an 2015 ETEC 250HO on it. I prefer the 4 blade Trophy plus (26p) at the moment but it is a couple mph slower than my 27p Raker II (3 blade). The Raker likes to chine walk more than the Trophy. 68 mph with the Trophy Plus, 70 mph with the Raker II. I have the factory 6 inch setback. Engine mounted up as high as she will go. The etecs are torquey and like to blow out so it has been a challenging, but fun quest for the perfect prop. (please dont tell me to hang a merc on the back of it) lol...

I am thinking of trying a 27p Trophy Plus since I am running close to 6000 rpm and can probably turn a higher pitch still. I dont know of any other 4 blades that the pulsare hull really likes. I am thinking I can get it to 75 with the right prop...and still be able to pull tubes and kids around if needed..

Thoughts? Your favorite prop??
Jeff

If you can try and get the motor back a bit further, it might help. You shouldn't be blowing out at all, so maybe you're too high. The Bravo props seem like a good recommendation and you have so many pitch options from Mercury Racing, the Bravo XS comes in .5 increments to dial it in.

Those motors have rubber mounts right? If you're noticing a lot of slop in the steering you may want to go to solid mounts, it will handle way better.

I think you have a lot more speed in it, good luck, looking forward to seeing how it goes.

 

[JUPITER PULSARE]

Thought I would ask again since there seems to be quite a few more choices in props available than a couple years ago. I am currently playing around trying to find the best prop for my 2100 BR with an 2015 ETEC 250HO on it. I prefer the 4 blade Trophy plus (26p) at the moment but it is a couple mph slower than my 27p Raker II (3 blade). The Raker likes to chine walk more than the Trophy. 68 mph with the Trophy Plus, 70 mph with the Raker II. I have the factory 6 inch setback. Engine mounted up as high as she will go. The etecs are torquey and like to blow out so it has been a challenging, but fun quest for the perfect prop. (please dont tell me to hang a merc on the back of it) lol...

I am thinking of trying a 27p Trophy Plus since I am running close to 6000 rpm and can probably turn a higher pitch still. I dont know of any other 4 blades that the pulsare hull really likes. I am thinking I can get it to 75 with the right prop...and still be able to pull tubes and kids around if needed..

Thoughts? Your favorite prop??
Jeff

Jeff, your 1st issue is lack of setback. The Pulsare 2100 needs 12-14" of setback to really free the hull up. Adding another 6" of setback alone will net you at least 3-5mph and improve your handling!

 

[Mark]

Jeff, your 1st issue is lack of setback. The Pulsare 2100 needs 12-14" of setback to really free the hull up. Adding another 6" of setback alone will net you at least 3-5mph and improve your handling!

I think this would be accurate advice for a Merc. Not sure I would agree with an Etec. The weight of these motors sits further back. Ask the guys running these motors like Sam and Skip. 12-14" of setback and you will need to add trim tabs to prevent porpoising. I reduced the setback on my Starliner from 13" to 11" to 8" and finally to 6" before the boat felt balanced. They also have more trouble with blowout because they have much higher torque out of the hole than a Merc. They are a great motor but a very different animal.

 

[blacktruck]

I think this would be accurate advice for a Merc. Not sure I would agree with an Etec. The weight of these motors sits further back. Ask the guys running these motors like Sam and Skip. 12-14" of setback and you will need to add trim tabs to prevent porpoising. I reduced the setback on my Starliner from 13" to 11" to 8" and finally to 6" before the boat felt balanced. They also have more trouble with blowout because they have much higher torque out of the hole than a Merc. They are a great motor but a very different animal.

Is it a G1 or 2? And the pulsare hull is very different than a flite or liner, so you'd want it further back as there is no notch and the pulsare has a pad. I hear the G2G is really powerful but I doubt moreso than a 300XS or 300X, which most guys run with about 12-14" of set back. Try it though. Looking forward to seeing how it goes. Has to be way more speed in it if it's a G2.

 

[Mark]

Not trying to pick a fight but you guys are giving him bad advice. The Etec has 4" more setback than a Merc, 20% more low end torque and weight distribution further back still. When Ranger rigs a boat with an Etec they reduce setback from 12" to 6". They are a different animal and conventional Merc wisdom does not work.

 

[karzrus]

Not trying to pick a fight but you guys are giving him bad advice. The Etec has 4" more setback than a Merc, 20% more low end torque and weight distribution further back still. When Ranger rigs a boat with an Etec they reduce setback from 12" to 6". They are a different animal and conventional Merc wisdom does not work.

This good info and I noticed your earlier post on it. So after my poor advice, I left it alone for a while in hopes the e-tec guys would help and provide better input.

But I note now that since he has a 6 " bracket and there is 4 " of built in set back on the motor, he is at 10 " total now. That is the lower end of where Pulsares like it. He is not getting everything from that motor if he is only going 68mph with a 26 Trophy plus ( gear ratio being equal) so what is the problem?

1. Not trimmed out enough?
2. Prop not high enough in relation to the pad?( need low water pick ups to get where it needs to be)
3. Short 4-5" of set back?
4. Wrong prop? or pitch for gear ratio?
5. By design E-tec can't do what a Merc can?( I doubt this and I'm not trying to pick a fight with this or any of the other comments and questions, rather just trying to cover everything that might be affecting the outcome.)

I tried to list in order of importance but in this case the Prop could easily be number one on the list, and I'm far from an expert here so lots might be missing.

Do E-tec's build power right to 6000+rpm or do they like to run a 5500? if so maybe a 27 or 28 pitch Trophy plus solves his problem.

 

[blacktruck]

Not trying to pick a fight but you guys are giving him bad advice. The Etec has 4" more setback than a Merc, 20% more low end torque and weight distribution further back still. When Ranger rigs a boat with an Etec they reduce setback from 12" to 6". They are a different animal and conventional Merc wisdom does not work.

It is not bad advice. First, he can't have much less set back. Second, very different hull than a Ranger. Finally, the G2 is definitely heavy, its not way heavier than a 300x or XS though. Doesnt make 20% more torque either.

Here is a pulsare with a 300X rigged by Randy, with his custom setback bracket.
And a Tuff 21 which is more similiar, with a 250 HO and a paralift with huge setback.

Since you can not really go with less than the OP has, and it works well with other set ups, it is not bad advice. By all means, test different props and dial it in as it is but if you have the same handling and performance issues, go further back.

Sorry about the long links. First two are the boats. The last one is a torque comparison between 300X and XS.
https://www.google.com/search?q=pul...UICSgB&biw=1024&bih=664#imgrc=wf0ltiA8EfHUhM:

https://www.google.com/search?q=tuf...&biw=1024&bih=653&dpr=2#imgrc=jjc7i6ZI7DD-xM:
http://www.davebushracing.com/mercury-optimax300x-update.html

 

[Skip 7750]

I am pretty sure that a G1 ETEC starts reducing ignition timing somewhere around 5500 rpm. This is done so it can get a 3 star emission rating. On the bottom end the G1 has more torque than the same hp Optimax. This might be why the Mercs are a little faster on the top end, since they don't pull timing out. I don't know if the G2 pulls timing or not. I have never even seen one except for photos.

At the mid 60s speeds about 2.5 to 3" below the bottom of the boat is about the best height. Around 80 or so, you need to go up much higher. The farther you set the engine back, the higher you need to go because the water is coming off the rear of the boat at an up angle.

Moving the motor back changes the CG and lifts the bow. It can also cause porpoising which can be eliminated with adjustable trim tabs. If you want to go faster, move it back. If you are happy with how fast it is now, just enjoy the fact that you have a great family boat that can pull kids tubing and still run almost 70 mph. Skip

 

[blacktruck]

Moving the motor back changes the CG and lifts the bow. It can also cause porpoising which can be eliminated with adjustable trim tabs. If you want to go faster, move it back. If you are happy with how fast it is now, just enjoy the fact that you have a great family boat that can pull kids tubing and still run almost 70 mph. Skip

Definitely don't put trim tabs on it. And if it isn't handling well and has more speed in it, you want to set it up so it's safer and more efficient.

I think the OP was looking for prop recommendations. He can pretty much only move the motor back as he is running the minimal setback now and I don't believe he was happy with the performance. I still haven't heard if this is a G1 or G2. Either way, it should be quite a bit faster than OP is achieving.

Would love to hear if he tried some Bravo props. Hydromotive makes some really good props too.

Pad bottoms with a flush transom like setback. Ask Wildman, he's setup big motors on Pulsares forever and he uses about 16" of setback, 12" bracket + 4" jack plate.
I've had my Pulsare for 20 years.

Superboat:

G2 HO, porta bracket, huge setback.

 

[Skip 7750]

Trim tabs stopped all porpoising and lost zero mph. They are also great at keeping the bow down when pulling kids on tubes. You can also balance the boat, side to side, when you have more weight on one side. There are no minuses to them! Skip

 

[blacktruck]

Trim tabs stopped all porpoising and lost zero mph. They are also great at keeping the bow down when pulling kids on tubes. You can also balance the boat, side to side, when you have more weight on one side. There are no minuses to them! Skip

Lots of minuses to them on a small boat like the Pulsare. Especially since you don't need them. Definitely don't use them in this application.

Do you have them on your Pulsare?

 

[jhw304]

Thanks for all the discussion and advice!!
My motor is a G1 250 ho 2015 model. I am trying a RX4 26P at the moment. The lake has been too busy or too windy to get a real good run in with the holiday traffic. The etec seems to like the larger diameter props Raker, RX4 etc. I got it up to 75 with the Raker II 27p and it was still very driveable. I am happy with that kind of speed. The rx4 at 26p might be just a tad too much prop since I was only turning 5100 full throttle, but I am hoping I can trim it up more and get her out of the water when things on the lake settle down. The RX4 has adjustable PVS vents, so I am playing with those as well trying to get up on plane quicker. I think 75 is possible with this 4 blade as well if I can get my RPMs up, if not a 25p RX4 might be he perfect fit. The Trophy plus props work pretty well but are a smaller diameter than the RX4 so it is hard to compare pitch for pitch. I hopefully will have an update in the next day or so on what the max speed is on the RX4. Thanks again for the advice!!!

 

[blacktruck]

Thanks for all the discussion and advice!!
My motor is a G1 250 ho 2015 model. I am trying a RX4 26P at the moment. The lake has been too busy or too windy to get a real good run in with the holiday traffic. The etec seems to like the larger diameter props Raker, RX4 etc. I got it up to 75 with the Raker II 27p and it was still very driveable. I am happy with that kind of speed. The rx4 at 26p might be just a tad too much prop since I was only turning 5100 full throttle, but I am hoping I can trim it up more and get her out of the water when things on the lake settle down. The RX4 has adjustable PVS vents, so I am playing with those as well trying to get up on plane quicker. I think 75 is possible with this 4 blade as well if I can get my RPMs up, if not a 25p RX4 might be he perfect fit. The Trophy plus props work pretty well but are a smaller diameter than the RX4 so it is hard to compare pitch for pitch. I hopefully will have an update in the next day or so on what the max speed is on the RX4. Thanks again for the advice!!!

Glad you're happy, sounds like you're on the right track. Love that motor! I found a thread on scream and fly about your motor, the boat is a 24 Super which is obviously different. But, the takeaways were he was revving up more, to 6100 RPM, running a smaller prop: Trophy 13 3/4 X 24 and a Tempest 25".

Solid mounts are a good suggestion too.

Checkout the Post: http://www.screamandfly.com/showthr...HO-on-a-24-SuperBoat-prop-suggestions-welcome