Best setup for a Starflite?

[Rob'Z]

I know there is a thread about this in the Play to Win section but I thought it would be good to post this question in here.

I have an '87 Starflite with an '87 225 Evinrude sitting on 8.5" of setback manual JP turning a 24" Raker. At WOT with (IMO) decent positive trim I was only seeing 5300 RPM. I hear these engines are limited to 6700 and like to stay around 6500, is this correct? The previous owner said he saw 68 on GPS at 5700 RPM with this setup but he also said he had a 20' tall rooster tail. This seems excessive to me but I am new to this whole thing (previous experience has been with I/O boats). He also said at that speed only the last 3' of the hull was in contact with the water. The boat has a water pressure guage and it read above 11 psi even with a decent rooster tail. What is the lowest SAFE water pressure?

Here is a vid of a pass, this is the highest I have had the engine trimmed so far. Do I need to go higher?

http://media.putfile.com/Checkmate-Fly-By25

I did not get a chance to measure the propshaft height but it looked like ~2-3" below the vee (before the step in the transom). Is this a good height?

As for the prop, is the 24" Raker a good prop for this boat/setup? It has a horrible holeshot but I think that the engine needs to be re-jetted to my altitude (~1000 ft above sea level, came from RI=sea level). As soon as the boat gets on plane it flies.

If I do need to change the prop would it be worth it to go to a 4 or even 5 blade? I hear they get a better hold in the turns with only a small sacrifice in top speed.

Thanks for the help.

 

[Rob'Z]

I know there is a thread about this in the Play to Win section but I thought it would be good to post this question in here.

I have an '87 Starflite with an '87 225 Evinrude sitting on 8.5" of setback manual JP turning a 24" Raker. At WOT with (IMO) decent positive trim I was only seeing 5300 RPM. I hear these engines are limited to 6700 and like to stay around 6500, is this correct? The previous owner said he saw 68 on GPS at 5700 RPM with this setup but he also said he had a 20' tall rooster tail. This seems excessive to me but I am new to this whole thing (previous experience has been with I/O boats). He also said at that speed only the last 3' of the hull was in contact with the water. The boat has a water pressure guage and it read above 11 psi even with a decent rooster tail. What is the lowest SAFE water pressure?

Here is a vid of a pass, this is the highest I have had the engine trimmed so far. Do I need to go higher?

http://media.putfile.com/Checkmate-Fly-By25

I did not get a chance to measure the propshaft height but it looked like ~2-3" below the vee (before the step in the transom). Is this a good height?

As for the prop, is the 24" Raker a good prop for this boat/setup? It has a horrible holeshot but I think that the engine needs to be re-jetted to my altitude (~1000 ft above sea level, came from RI=sea level). As soon as the boat gets on plane it flies.

If I do need to change the prop would it be worth it to go to a 4 or even 5 blade? I hear they get a better hold in the turns with only a small sacrifice in top speed.

Thanks for the help.

 

[boatman4021]

Hey friend, The thing to remember is that you will not see the same performance at 1000ft above sea level as you did at sea level. A difference of 1000' is enough make more than 400rpm difference. My merc 225efi turn's 5600rpm at 1650' above sea level. It will go past 6000rpm's with ease at 850' above sea level. boatman

 

[Rob'Z]

Just checked and the altitude where I boat is actually ~1300' above sea level. Looks like I definately need to re-jet then. I didn't get a chance to take a look at the plugs while I was up there this time. Is there any hope to regain some of the RPM/speed?

 

[boatman4021]

You can gain some, but it very hard to over come the effects of altitude. This one of the reason's that drag racer's and nascar driver's run faster or slower at different location's. You can tweak your set-up and play with different prop's along with changing jet's but you will still be able to go to a lower altitude and run faster! Would you be interested in trying one of my prop's? I have one that may help some. boatman

 

[Mark]

First, measure the propshaft height. It is my experience that they start to slip and lose lift above 2.5". 2.5"- 3" seems to be the sweet spot. Without even more setback you are going to have to trim it right out to get your max speed and it will probably have a huge rooster tail. I heard of one guy adding 18" of setback before he was able to run the motor with zero trim and still get lift. That's an extreme load on the poor transom. Most guys think 11-12" is necessary.
For your holeshot you need some ventilation. Does your Raker have vent holes? If not you could have them added. Another way to vent a prop is to add spacers between the trust washer and prop. It allows exhaust to escape over the hub and greatly improves holeshot. I added 2 SS washers drilled to exactly 1" on my 130 Yamaha in the avatar. Cut my holeshot time with a load in half.
For what it is worth I run a 25" Renegade on my 200 EFI Merc and the hole shot is great and I'm at 1100 feet above sea level. They have a small hub so they vent over the hub. Talk to Mooneys he has one and I don't think he like t. Maybe he'll let you try to buy.

 

[Rob'Z]

I would definately be willing to try a prop if you have some loaners. It won't be until next season though.

There are three vent holes on my 24" Raker. It looks like three additional holes were added (for a total of six) but then welded over. I guess the extra ones didn't help.

jrumon said he was running his propshaft 1/2" below the vee to get 87mph out of his Starflite. Do you think the difference may be that the Starliner has a heavier bow?

 

[boatman4021]

That's a hard comparison to make. I could be wrong, but I think jrumon was running a 300pro max. Every boat and motor combination is different. Remember, thefaster you go without changing your set back, the less engine height you can run without breaking loose. This is because the boat is not as deep and the water coming out from under the back of the boat is not as high. boatman

 

[Rob'Z]

Yes he was running a 300. I see what you are saying, the stern of his boat was deeper because the engine was heavier and his setback was 10". Makes sense, I am slowly starting to learn all the mechanics of going fast on the water.

 

[Chris]

A stock '87 Rude can turn 6,700 RPM?

 

[Rob'Z]

That's just what I was told. What is the limiter set at, if it has one? What is the max safe RPM?

 

[Mark]

I've read that they either have a 6200 or 6700 rev limiter depending on the model. Recommended max RPM will be between 5500-6000 depending on the year. Call an OMC dealer, give him your serial number and ask him to look it up. I don't think those motors last long over 6000 RPM.
Concerning Jrumon's engine height, I think he was using an over the hub prop which are meant to be run much higher. The 300 Promax doesn't weigh much more than your 225. The bigger difference is he was turning his prop 6500+ RPM with 1.75 gears, and running in the high 80's as compared to the high 60's like you and me. I've reseached this for a couple of years now and the guys running fishing motors like ours need to bury the prop a bit to get the bow lift.
These boats are just not the rocketships everybody wants them to be. What there are are moderately fast lake boats that you can use any day of the week when the Allisons are tied up at the dock.

 

[Rob'Z]

I'm not trying to make it a rocketship (75+), just trying to get the best out of my current setup (maybe change to a different prop). I bought this Starflite because I have always loved the style of this hull and the price was right. It is fast enough for me right now I just don't want to be lugging the engine if it's supposed to be revving higher.

I will call and find out the specs of my engine, good idea.

Thanks for the info everyone. It is appreciated.

 

[Mark]

Let us know what you find out. You have a great looking Mate. I looked at your video, seems like it is riding about right.
I remember in 1986 my friend bought one of the first ever Starflites. We were wowed by its lines. They were rated for a 300 in the first year and he had a 150 Johnson bolted directly to the transom. In those days almost nobody had 200+ motors. The dealers in our area just didn't carry them. It was like a Sunday afternoon cruise at WOT. He couldn't break 50 MPH. It looked faster when it was standing still. The dealer ordered him a 175 Johnny and that was better, but it never ran like they do today, with jacked up big blocks and SS props.

 

[Chris]

Set up properly, Starflites are pretty good performers.

The Kunkels had one back in the mid 80's that ran around 90 with a V8 300 Rude. And jrumon had his running 86ish with a 300 Promax. Not too bad if you ask me. That's not too far off what a Pulsare runs with similar power. Maybe 5 MPH.

I tried to find the maximum RPM range for a '87 Rude, but had no luck. There used to be a website where you could look most redlines up but I can't find it. It was in another language but you could sorta figure it out. Maybe one of the members knows it and throw us a link.

It seems to me that most of the "fishing motahs" aren't rated to go much over the mid 5's as far as RPM's go. I usually recall them being in the 5400 to 5800 range depending on the model. So I'd be shocked if a '87 Rude was rated for the mid 6's. But maybe they are, I'm just guessing. I would definitely check into it before I started spinning it faster than you are now though.

Here's a pic of the Kunkel's vintage Flite with the old 3.6 Rude.

 

[Chris]

 

[JW]

Boy would I love to find one of those in a barn somewhere in perfect condition.....................

 

[merc245]

 

[merc245]

ROB Z, Heres a thought. I've seen your video and you are trimed to much for having that much hull still being wet.I understand you have 8 inches of set back. That is a good start. Here might be part of the proplem why.......Moisture in the bow foam.Both jrmond and I have found that the foam in our front bulkheads were full of water. Easly over 100lbs in my case.I felt that that the bow just didn't fly like it before.Now its light as ever! 1 huge differance. You would never know if you don't test.

P.S. Still don't have the pic transfer thing down yet. So go to 'pic this' forum. 1st page 3/4 down and vist mercs245 pic gallery and see my set up and me under power with reguards to how wet the hull is and how perpendicalur the motor is to the waters surface. I think I'm at 50/55 mph at this time. The water was to rough to do any better. merc245

 

[Mark]

That's a good thought about the bow foam. Almost everybody finds theirs wet. Ironically, my floor was wet and rotten and the bow foam was dry. Go figure?
Rob, just for reference, here are my engine height numbers and corresponding speed at WOT with a 25" Renegade and 11" setback;
2" below = 63mph
2.25" below = 66mph
2.5" below = 69mph
As you can see my speed increased substantially as I lowered the motor. That was because the prop was slipping at the higher levels. I think I'm pretty close at 2.5", but I never had a chance to experiment with this setback any more before I put her away for the year. With 8" setback my sweet spot was at 2.75" below. Mess with your engine height a little before you start the expensive prop swapping game. As mentioned earlier every setup combo is different and you have to experiment to find out what is going to work best.