groundloop
Active member
Hey jboyd, I've taken so long getting my engine right that I haven't had any reason to look at this thread in forever. I may have a suggestion or two for your Eluder (if you're not done yet). If I had it to do all over again I'd glass some 2X lumber on the deck and put pedestals on them for mounting the seats instead of doing seat boxes, it's a pain to get your hand inside the seat box for mounting the seats. I'd also plan ahead for some storage, I've got a stereo in the dash on the passenger side so don't even have a glove box.
Anyway, I finally worked through all the issues with the engine and had the Eluder out today for another test run. The engine actually ran pretty good (FINALLY
) this time and I managed to get 62 mph at 6000 rpm in fairly choppy conditions, running a 23 pitch Renegade prop 3 inches below the pad with a 6" manual jackplate. This was the first time I've had this boat out that everything went essentially according to plan, and 4 hours later I've still got a big sh#% eatin' grin on my face. The boat didn't have any bad manners at all, no chine walk or anything, and it handled the chop and wakes from other boats easily (much better than I was expecting).
I did identify a few small issues that still need to be addressed, but overall everything was great. The prop "blew out" a few times coming out of a turn, so I may need to use the optional weed ring. I have the trim tab adjusted as far as it will go and it's still difficult to turn to port while on plane, so I guess I'll be adding a trim wedge (is that what they're called?) to the skeg. Also, after I finished the numerous repairs on the engine I adjusted the idle as best as I could on muffs - turns out I missed by a little bit and need to bring the idle timing up a bit more, no big deal.
Seeing as how I've got very little time in this boat I didn't want to risk driving it on the trailer without it idling properly so went wading (in 45 degree water !!!) and walked her back on the trailer. That water was COLD.
As far as the engine, don't EVER buy anything from Frank Mathews in Savannah, GA
. First off the lower unit was trash, so JTPatroni was great and sold me an old one he had sitting around for real cheap with the warning that I shouldn't trust the internals. Well, I often don't listen, and decided to just bolt it on and give it a try (after prepping and painting it). Well, that didn't work out so well (I should have listened), so I disassembled both lower units to see if I could make one good one out of the two. Turns out the gears weren't interchangeable, but the clutch dog was, and thankfully that's what was needed. Today it worked just fine.
Next, the cooling problem. Turns out someone had really trashed the cooling system. There originally was a water line running from the back of one thermostat housing to the other, and then to a "water control valve". Someone had removed the water control valve and simply plugged off the hose at the thermostat housing. This allowed one thermostat to lift off the seat at high engine rpms, but not the other - therefore one side of the engine overheated. A guy on iboats put me onto a great modification for this system where you throw away the water control valve, thermostat housings, and interconnect hoses and instead use the spring and thermostat housing from a '89 70 HP. It's a straight bolt on and works like a champ.
When I did a compression check one bank of cylinders were all about 10 PSI lower than the other. I took a real close look and noticed that there were 2 head gaskets on the starboard side. WTF???
. I was afraid someone was trying to hide a warped head or some other serious issue so pulled the heads and measured everything very carefully. Everything was ok, so I put the heads back on with a proper head gasket. Magically all the cylinders had the same compression.
Then.... When it never would idle right (it would miss every few seconds) I looked at the carbs again with a fine toothed comb. Turns out two of them had hairline cracks at the bleed air circuits. I couldn't find two carbs that were an exact match to the ones I had so wound up buying a complete set from a '96 200. That didn't hurt my feelings all that bad because it turns out that all the "experts" say that those '96 carbs are the best ones to get, and I got a good deal on them.
After replacing the carbs it started much easier, but still wouldn't idle correctly. Next I figured out that instead of using proper recirc valves someone had just put on plain brass hose barbs. I was told by several people who should know that it's possible this would make it idle bad, and that running it like this could cause engine damage. So I bit the bullet and bought new recirc valves (6 at $20 a pop). But that still didn't fix the intermittent miss.
I built a DVA adapter for my multi-meter and ran through all the factory tests for the ignition. Also, with a timing light you could actually watch it miss, this was happening on 5 of the 6 cylinders. I wound up replacing both the power pack and timer base, and FINALLY it runs right and idles smoothly. It sounded really nice today, and as I mentioned I just need to give it a couple more degrees of timing at idle to bring the idle speed up a couple hundred rpms and it should be perfect (or as close to perfect as you're going to get with a 23 year old engine).
SO... I've learned way way more about outboard engines than I ever wanted to know, but I'm now happy with my Eluder. I think I'll still have a bit of nervousness about that engine for a while now, until it proves itself trustworthy.
Anyway, I finally worked through all the issues with the engine and had the Eluder out today for another test run. The engine actually ran pretty good (FINALLY
) this time and I managed to get 62 mph at 6000 rpm in fairly choppy conditions, running a 23 pitch Renegade prop 3 inches below the pad with a 6" manual jackplate. This was the first time I've had this boat out that everything went essentially according to plan, and 4 hours later I've still got a big sh#% eatin' grin on my face. The boat didn't have any bad manners at all, no chine walk or anything, and it handled the chop and wakes from other boats easily (much better than I was expecting). I did identify a few small issues that still need to be addressed, but overall everything was great. The prop "blew out" a few times coming out of a turn, so I may need to use the optional weed ring. I have the trim tab adjusted as far as it will go and it's still difficult to turn to port while on plane, so I guess I'll be adding a trim wedge (is that what they're called?) to the skeg. Also, after I finished the numerous repairs on the engine I adjusted the idle as best as I could on muffs - turns out I missed by a little bit and need to bring the idle timing up a bit more, no big deal.
Seeing as how I've got very little time in this boat I didn't want to risk driving it on the trailer without it idling properly so went wading (in 45 degree water !!!) and walked her back on the trailer. That water was COLD.
As far as the engine, don't EVER buy anything from Frank Mathews in Savannah, GA
. First off the lower unit was trash, so JTPatroni was great and sold me an old one he had sitting around for real cheap with the warning that I shouldn't trust the internals. Well, I often don't listen, and decided to just bolt it on and give it a try (after prepping and painting it). Well, that didn't work out so well (I should have listened), so I disassembled both lower units to see if I could make one good one out of the two. Turns out the gears weren't interchangeable, but the clutch dog was, and thankfully that's what was needed. Today it worked just fine.Next, the cooling problem. Turns out someone had really trashed the cooling system. There originally was a water line running from the back of one thermostat housing to the other, and then to a "water control valve". Someone had removed the water control valve and simply plugged off the hose at the thermostat housing. This allowed one thermostat to lift off the seat at high engine rpms, but not the other - therefore one side of the engine overheated. A guy on iboats put me onto a great modification for this system where you throw away the water control valve, thermostat housings, and interconnect hoses and instead use the spring and thermostat housing from a '89 70 HP. It's a straight bolt on and works like a champ.
When I did a compression check one bank of cylinders were all about 10 PSI lower than the other. I took a real close look and noticed that there were 2 head gaskets on the starboard side. WTF???
. I was afraid someone was trying to hide a warped head or some other serious issue so pulled the heads and measured everything very carefully. Everything was ok, so I put the heads back on with a proper head gasket. Magically all the cylinders had the same compression.Then.... When it never would idle right (it would miss every few seconds) I looked at the carbs again with a fine toothed comb. Turns out two of them had hairline cracks at the bleed air circuits. I couldn't find two carbs that were an exact match to the ones I had so wound up buying a complete set from a '96 200. That didn't hurt my feelings all that bad because it turns out that all the "experts" say that those '96 carbs are the best ones to get, and I got a good deal on them.
After replacing the carbs it started much easier, but still wouldn't idle correctly. Next I figured out that instead of using proper recirc valves someone had just put on plain brass hose barbs. I was told by several people who should know that it's possible this would make it idle bad, and that running it like this could cause engine damage. So I bit the bullet and bought new recirc valves (6 at $20 a pop). But that still didn't fix the intermittent miss.
I built a DVA adapter for my multi-meter and ran through all the factory tests for the ignition. Also, with a timing light you could actually watch it miss, this was happening on 5 of the 6 cylinders. I wound up replacing both the power pack and timer base, and FINALLY it runs right and idles smoothly. It sounded really nice today, and as I mentioned I just need to give it a couple more degrees of timing at idle to bring the idle speed up a couple hundred rpms and it should be perfect (or as close to perfect as you're going to get with a 23 year old engine).
SO... I've learned way way more about outboard engines than I ever wanted to know, but I'm now happy with my Eluder. I think I'll still have a bit of nervousness about that engine for a while now, until it proves itself trustworthy.
A lesser man (me) would of given up and bought a new motor, even if I couldn't affort it.