Checkmates NEW 40 footer

[corey331]

OK... kinda back on topic..... OTH, any chance you are gonna bring this boat to the Cumberland Poker Run in September later this year? I would really like to see it in person, and in action!!

 

[Craig]

Craig it is very obvious that you do know much about boat building and fabric considering Chop Strand Mat is a general purpose reinforcement material . It is composed of (CHOPPED FIBERGLASS) of various lengths that are held togather with a chemical binder which is commonly used because of its low cost and the good bond that is provides between layers of woven roving or fiberglass cloth , and 1708 is a Biaxial with a layer of (CHOPPED MATT) stitiched into the fabric which is commonly used with Vinyl or Poly .

You asked what the skin was. I'm just saying the literature says "cloth, 1708, and mat"...it doesn't say anything about woven roving. My understanding is that cloth does not mean woven roving, nor does 1708, or the term mat. Are they hiding something from us? I have only seen one checkmate with the skin exposed and that was my 2000 pulsare that got hit by a car and skid down the road 100+ feet. I did not see any woven roving....maybe it's in there somewhere? Also my understanding is that the 1708 which has chopped strand mat should not be confused with what comes out of a chopper gun.

Please correct me if I am wrong. And no, I don't know anything about building boats.


-Craig

 

[Craig]

OK..time to add my two cents worth! As far as mold and gelcoat work goes, Checkmate is second to none. Their balsa core work is also very well done. Where they've lacked in the past was the stringer/bulkhead/flooring workmanship. Poorly controlled laminating, sloppy glass work, raw wood left unprotected, etc. etc. This is why many older Checkmates get rebuilt. Unlike Hydrostreams where the core is the main culprit, Checkmates failures lie in the structure under the floor. I understand the desire to keep the costs of boat building down..especially during a bad economy..but if Checkmate switched to high density PVC coring materials (Mantex, Coosa Board, Airex PXC, etc.) for their stringers, transoms, bulkheads, etc. none of their boats would require rebuilding today. Glassing the topdeck and hull around the entire perimeter would also help the structural integrity of the final product along with vacuum bagging during the layup. All these suggestions are time consuming and costly that would have to be passed to the consumer. As far as this 40'?? Checkmate that is being built......I'm sure Checkmate is going the xtra measure to make this boat outstanding in every way. If they're going to enter the "high end custom" offshore world they will have to compete with the likes of Hustler, Outerlimits, Active Thunder, Eliminator, DCB, Skater, Spectra, Sonic, etc. Unless they've built an entire new mold...the only new 40+' mold I know of in the last 10 years came out of the defunct lawsuit "Apache" out of Delray Beach. Alot of talent went into retooling and straightening out the old 41' Apache mold including Steve Koss, Steve Wilson, Bob Sacente, etc. After they lost the lawsuit to McManus, I'm not sure where that 41' mold went??? But it was bad azz and would've built an incredible boat!!! Sacente had a 41' mold with xtremely turned down outer chines that were built as "Chiefs"...only a few were made...including one 37' Chief based on the Active Thunder 37' AVH mold.....which brings me back to reality....what 40' mold are they using for this project??

Jup, I can't argue with what you are saying, I know you did alot on your pulsare...but...just one point, just because one boat has those issues doesn't mean they all do. Sometimes the wood doesn't get completey covered, that's for sure, but more times than not I think it does. Seen a lot of old checkmates sit outside for years in the elements with no cover and are solid as the day they were built. If any boat with wood construction has a chance of surviving neglect, it's a checkmate.

Question on the high dentsity PVC for stringers, transoms - what are the other advantages besides resistance to water rot? Aren't they heavier? (Can talk over PM if you want.)

-Craig

 

[JUPITER PULSARE]

The reality is that there are many different kinds of fiberglass..mat, woven, stitched, backed, etc. of various densitys and strengths. You have biaxial, triaxial and quadaxial weaves, kevlar, S glass, knytex...the list is endless. It's the laminate properties, layup schedule, coring material, bedding material, type of resin, and types of glass used that adds to the strength of the finished product. If you want the best answers for boat building there is really only one source:

www.polymericproducts.com

Zeb is a "mad" scientist when it comes to plastics and fiberglass. He is responsible for building many boat molds and is well known in the south Florida boat builders world for his knowledge, improving laminate schedules, tensile strengths of various fiberglass, and has built race boats, surfboards, decorative displays, motorcycle and race car farings, race car body parts, etc. etc. etc.

 

[JUPITER PULSARE]

Jup, I can't argue with what you are saying, I know you did alot on your pulsare...but...just one point, just because one boat has those issues doesn't mean they all do. Sometimes the wood doesn't get completey covered, that's for sure, but more times than not I think it does. Seen a lot of old checkmates sit outside for years in the elements with no cover and are solid as the day they were built. If any boat with wood construction has a chance of surviving neglect, it's a checkmate.

Question on the high dentsity PVC for stringers, transoms - what are the other advantages besides resistance to water rot? Aren't they heavier? (Can talk over PM if you want.)

-Craig

You never know what you have until you dig under the floor. Many boats seem fine from the outside..but it's that hairline crack in the resin/glass that allows water to sneak it way into places you don't see and do nasty things as time goes by. Stringers/bulkheads/floor undersides left exposed will surely rot after time. By using PVC coring materials you take the "rot" out of boat building. The coring materials are lighter and easier to work with than wood. The high density coring materials have great compression ratios, don't absorb water, are fiber reinforced. When sandwiched between layers of cloth the strength is outstanding!

 

[hotdaddy27]

Ginger, really whats your point . everyone on this forum knows Checkmates have there flaws. you cant expect ferrari quality at a chevy price. you seem to know alot about boat construction and you could become an asset or an ass to this forum, your choice.

That was stated so well that it must appear twice in this thread.

Also, I prefer to call Checkmates "semi-custom". Makes me feel like my quickly depreciating piece of fiberglass is special.

HD

 

[ndaniels]

i think everybody needs to relax a little there are a lot worse things in this world than being called a production boat, fountain was a production boat, so was donzi anybody complaining about those names and hell just for the fun of it checkmate is better sheerly because they are still in buisness.
offshore ginger you do make some very valid points and raise some good concerns seeing as this is a very large project for the factory and something relatively new to these guys(not boat building but just one this large) but as on the hammer said they did their homework so hey lets give em the benefit of the doubt and see how she runs in the water cause thats all that matters. also i am well aware of your building prowess but maybe some of the other members here are not possibly you should start an introduction thread and show off some of your previous work just so we all know where you are coming from when you make points from a building perspective

X2... I've read quite a few posts from OG on other websites, but I don't think many around here know him.

 

[OFFSHORE GINGER]

Hey guys , first off.......... i am here..... only to to learn more about Checkmate boat's not only the past..... but the future for myself and future customers , and to make a long story short i have been in this business for over forty plus years now ........working at four different Boat Co's , and one being Skater for many many years ....doing just about everything from assisting in the build of plugs and mold's of the 28 , 36 , 40 , 46 , and doing fiberglass repair / custom fabrication .............along with building Fountains , Platinum Power Boats , Cigs , ( which were not your run of the mill production boats ) and boats for the Navy Seals all at Skater / Douglas Marine , and not to mention a mold which was going to be a joint venture between Baja and Skater which now is Skater's 399 V bottom . ( like Spiderman ) and like i stated in a previous post i apologize if i have offended any one at this point because that was not my intention and ..........................once again for the third time i Apologize ............................and can we please move on..................

 

[Big Red]

Boy this thread went to hell just like I new it would when I posted it. Glad I waited till winter instead of 6 months ago LMAO.

I dont give a damn what its made out of I want to see the cabin and creature comforts. Any boat will go down hill sitting outside uncovered.

 

[87MagnumII]

Be very intresting to see how the boat pans out, atleast its not made from a cut up Baja mold.

And what manufacturer are you referring to exactly?

 

[keith4216]

What part did you get lost on?

 

[Mark]

I am thrilled with where Doug is taking Checkmate. New models, custom builds and keeping the classic hulls as be. The fiberglass innerliner on outboards was long overdo. I totally agree with Jupiter though... They need to lose the wooden stringers and transom. It has always been the weak link in an otherwise beautiful and incredibly well built boat. I bet it would not add more than a few hundred dollars and could weigh even less.

 

[Denny Checkmate]

Something all new and more to come

I think we're pushing a little hard for info right now. I know everyones excited but I think Jeff is trying to keep some secrets until completion and the boat is revealed. But if there are any pics could you post some up?

Sometimes the boat industry is like the three big Auto makers in Detroit when rumors of a new model is coming.
We like to keep new projects quiet as possible untill the product is proven and ready.

When the right time comes, I am sure spy photo's will appear on this new 40 plus footer by Check. It will be more than you'd ever expect.
(Awesome water machine).

OFFICIAL: LOOK FOR the all new Checkmate 26 hull #1 to be released.
She is in production and will be unwrapped very soon at a boat show.

 

[Big Red]

Sometimes the boat industry is like the three big Auto makers in Detroit when rumors of a new model is coming.
We like to keep new projects quiet as possible untill the product is proven and ready.

When the right time comes, I am sure spy photo's will appear on this new 40 plus footer by Check. It will be more than you'd ever expect.
(Awesome water machine).

OFFICIAL: LOOK FOR the all new Checkmate 26 hull #1 to be released.
She is in production and will be unwrapped very soon at a boat show.

Tell us about the new 40 Denny, what boats will it be in the same league with,,, AT, Fountain, Donzi, Bayliner, Baja. Will it be a poker run racer with a useless cabin like a Cigarette. Or will it be a weekend looker with a loaded cabin like a AT or Hustler.

 

[hotdaddy27]

Denny,

Thanks for taking the time to come on the "Checkmate Fan Site" and give us as much information as you can at this point.

We look forward to seeing Checkmates new work!

HD

 

[jazzy]

Tell us about the new 40 Denny, what boats will it be in the same league with,,, AT, Fountain, Donzi, Bayliner, Baja. Will it be a poker run racer with a useless cabin like a Cigarette. Or will it be a weekend looker with a loaded cabin like a AT or Hustler.

That's a great question if they're using the chief mold it had the taller deck mold like the 36 did for more headroom hopefully they use it to the fullest

 

[OFFSHORE GINGER]

Denny did you work at PQ many years ago ?

 

[JUPITER PULSARE]

Ok...who is Denny Checkmate? Does Denny work for Checkmate??

 

[RNGRDVE]

Curious about that too. Here is his online profile.

• About Denny Checkmate Biography Checkmate Powerboats Representative Location Western Michigan Country Flag USA State/Provincial/Regional Flag US Michigan

 

[jln]

Denny posted a few times about this subject on OSO , he said wait until the miami boat show . looks like a CONCEPT logo in his avitar. Im not sure who Denny really is but i guess he will tell us . http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/checkmate/261116-checkmate-building-bigger-boat-4.html